There’s a story in the news up here about a hockey player who said something hurtful to a group — and now celebrities and ex-celebrities are coming out of the woodwork to admonish and condemn him and demand apologies.
But this irks me. I’ve been commenting much of late on how it is far superior to learn to control you own feelings and urges (in a domain where you have authority) over trying to insist others control themselves and their words around you (which is a domain where you don’t have authority or control) lest they “trigger” your emotions and feelings. It’s essentially asking others to do for you, the job of keeping your feelings and emotions on an even keel.
So please share. What are your thoughts on this process of trying to control what others might say, through public “punishment” — demanding their apologies, even demanding their jobs. Is it political correctness run amok — or a good process in your opinion?
I’m not suggesting we don’t have responsibility to control what comes out of our mouths. But if some loud doesn’t . . . should we be so “fragile” and “exposed” that our joy and peace is disrupted until they are properly “spanked” in public?
© 2026 – SoulSequel
47 responses to “Saying hurtful things”
I think a question to consider is why someone is apologizing?
Is it because they are really sorry, or is it because they realize that they have lost respect and want to offer it up out of trying to regain something they have lost
My favourite baseball player just issued an apology for a heat of the moment exchange. He is now less in my eyes. I’m sure part of his apology was sincere, but I also think he had organizational pressure and what is the motivation of a corporate entity; affect on the bottom line? The beliefs of management? The impact on the image of the team that reflects on everybody? I’m not sure how that all came into play.
But here is one thing I am sure of, when anyone of influence gets away with saying or doing something that is beneath societal standards; then it becomes the new standard.
If one of those types can say its ok to grab a woman by the pussy; the easily manipulated will accept that it is. If a role model calls a pitcher a faggot; then for some it becomes accepted as ok. A role model is just that; a model of behaviour and if they aren’t slammed down when they are out of line; it becomes ok.
No one should be immune to being called out on their stupidity.
Actually I was thinking of the Fool’s notion that we can control society by somehow controlling the noises that come out of another person’s mouth.
It seems to be more an act of self-righteousness and self-protection than any genuine concern for social righteousness.
Social righteousness needs to begin with us doing the right thing. By all means express your concerns with an off-color remark from someone who should know better. But don’t demand apology! Let them figure this out on their own and it will be more genuine. And if they don’t they reveal themselves as even less of a person than you thought.
Otherwise apology just becomes a Panacea delivered mainly for the purpose of making you shut up.
I was totally rewriting my response when the editor time though so please disregard all of that verbosity.
The entire crux of my post is “the apology — whom is it for?”
Are we suggesting it for the sake of the other person’s good process?
Or are we demanding it for the sake of our bad process?
It’s the difference between suggesting they have some work to do and us dictating exactly how that needs to happen.
One enriches them. The other impoverishes us.
I apologize for taking your question and trying to make it mine by answering the question I wanted it to be. (no sarcasm)
so, why did I apologize? Was it for me, or for you? Maybe a bit of both.
On the one hand, there is a degree of disrespect in not trying to fully understand the point you made the effort to make and for that, I want to apologize to you. On the other, I don’t like to be perceived as a person who is disrespectful of someone who deserves respect, so it is likely that I am trying to make myself regain a degree of self-esteem through my own self judgement.
…then again…maybe the best thing to do is not over-think and just move on, after trying to take something of a personal learning value from the experience.
I don’t know how often “I’m sorry” is any less rote inspired than “happy birthday”.
Here’s another “I’m sorry” category for you to consider. When you drive to a store to buy something specific that has been advertised and they don’t have any. Clerk says, “Sorry”. Are they really, or is it a device to escape responsibility?
An apology is an escape tactic when one has neither the intention nor the “authorization” to correct the wrong. (Ie, apologizing on behalf of another. Interesting, this was the very process Job was into that made him vulnerable to the devil’s tactics. He was trying to make sacrifices and apologies on behalf of his grown children)
From both your words here and knowing you offline I know that you are not trying to escape anything but to pursue good process. That makes an apology a very beautiful thing that one cannot help but graciously accept. Society’s process his turn the apology into a hollow ball of fluff.
An apology is a bid by the trespasser to ” restore good relationship”. It is the them saying, ” I do not want to trespass like that again and am making changes in myself” ( or areas I have undisputed authority in)
It CAN also include aspects of trying to “make it right” with the other person. But if it hinges upon this you are putting total control for your good process in another’s hands. Their bad process is empowered to bollocks your good process.
The runaway demanding of apologies from others is a bad process of seeking to control others or to exert yourself over others. Little good and considerable harm come from it.
Consider the apology our Prime Minister is set to “demand” from the Pope. Will it actually heal anyone or keep the process from happening again? Not likely.
What’s the deal with the PM asking for a papal apology? Haven’t heard that one.
For what people long dead, did half a century ago: the native residential schools.
I may be mistaken but I thought Pope John Paul II chose to apologize for these of his own volition and not because it was “demanded”.
I’ve said plenty of hurtful things and without apology. I say what I’m going to say without meaning to hurt with my words, but part of that goes back to filters of knowing what to say and when and when I’m feeling what’s going on is problematic or I’m insulted, I’m going to get as good as I give. I have asperger’s syndrome and the more tired I am, the less filters I have. If something I said got to the news I would explain just that and the fact and not really care because what I said would automatically be taken out of context of not only the complete situation, but my entire history as well.
My process is that if I say or do something that my conscience tells me was indeed hurtful, I will apologize. Fatigue, ADD and grief not withstanding . I know first-hand that fatigue and my “condition” (and processes like grief) can have us acting in ways and saying things that are NOT representative of the person we want to be .
And the apology first and foremost, for the good process of the person convicted of having trespassed against another. There may be good reasons why I said or did it. But may I never see them as “excuses”. For that is not the kind of person I want to be.
And then if the situation “went public” and people wanted to bend and disregard context, that would become their heavy burden to carry. I would have already owned the trespass as it is, did everything within my power to reconcile, and moved on. If they still want to run with it, that is their shame and not mine.
My point is simply this: I have no desire to play into the limelight. To me if someone has a problem with what I’ve said (or what I’ve done) it’s their problem, not mine. They don’t have to deal with me. And I don’t have to deal with them.
Self improvement/ correction = Limelight?
Who knew??!
Self improvement is necessarily directed by the self. Anything else, anything outside of self, anything pointed out is OTHERS correction.
I’m still wondering where “limelight” comes in!
Correcting ourselves by just the compass of just ourselves invites shipwreck. It’s like sighting the course of a ship off of two objects on the deck rather than using one object that is “removed” from the ship. What looks like a safe course (from a perspective isolated from the “outside” world) could easily be a disaster-in-process.
There’s also a HELL of a lot of arrogance in presuming nothing of any importance (when it comes to self-correction) can come from outside the self.
Limelight = public (i.e, media)
I think it’s actually MORE arrogance that a person (even god) to say “I know better than you in every situation, do what I say!” I’ve come across people like this, and have been told “in real life if you did something like that you’d be hurt or killed.” (and in god’s case it’s do as I say, NOT as I do, which is even a worse sentiment!) The idea of SELF correction is that it needs to be at the core something the person wants to do. If it’s pointed out that XYZ needs to change, and the person in question doesn’t want to change it, of what use is the person changing (even if done successfully)? The idea behind the change is it’s self directed, and understood what needs to change, why it needs to change, what things need to change for the change to “stick,” what the benefit of the change is. This is, at the core, the problem with the concept of sin “don’t do X because it makes me unhappy and it hurts you” god says. The things that the bible says a person needs to change in order to gain eternal life, yet these selfsame concepts are by and far not useful in this life.
AT day’s end, ultimately, I’ve found that in trying to do good/ avoid evil (i.e. asking the holy spirit to live through me), asking for god’s help causes more problems than it’s worth. I’m better off saying “no thanks,” and living my own life the way I see fit, and dealing with the consequences after death.
Left up to us, most people would not change unless they were on fire. (And then some still wouldn’t, just because someone else had said “Hey you’re on fire!”. That is the nature of foolish pride.)
We are also at the point in this conversation where it would be beneficial to recognize that most of your perspectives have come from a religion of book worship and not God worship.
Consider also that the Holy Spirit does not live “through” you. The Holy Spirit lives “in” you, once you have moved past just the book or religion as your savior.
Then as others give you input, you don’t have to take it personally so ego flares. Rather, you can take it to the Holy Spirit who is in you.
In/ through, whatever! The point is that having the holy spirit in my life. Didn’t help get a job. get friends, be nicer, wiser. smarter, luckier, healthier, etc, etc, etc no matter what I asked. The point no benefit. So no.
Again, the observation that apparently have NO idea who God is, or the purpose/role of the Holy Spirit IN your heart; paid for at such high cost by Jesus Christ.
I’m sorry you haven’t gotten jobs or luck or ponies or cars or “smarts” from the genie you served. But did you really expect a book or ritual or ceremony or “service” would give you these things as from a vending-machine?
But if the bible is true, “my word WILL NOT return void!” The point is using God’s words should guarantee the results. Obviously not only in my case, but literally every Christian I know have the EXACT same problem, but it’s not as if they will admit it.
God’s word is “a unit”. One cannot just pull out the parts about “getting stuff”, or the parts that seem to support the notion that one can treat God like a vending machine where the currency is “religious works”.
Try as you might, you cannot “use” God.
What about healing/ reducing pain? What about wisdom to deal with their situations — i.e. their spouses, friends, family, work situations (nothing to do with money, just dealing with difficult coworkers, clients/ customers)? What about being better with their finances and / or tithing and gifting– the VERY thing god commands us to test him in!? and this command comes with a promise that the storehouses of heaven will be opened up! So something doesn’t quite “add up” here!
What doesn’t add up, is us thinking it’s a 1-way covenant: just “our way”. That religion you followed was “just our way”: thinking that religious performance and “work of our hands” would make God beholding to us so we could “test” Him with a few hoops. “Good puppy/bad puppy”.
What arrogance has us believing we can wring a salvation of our own works and understanding, and then “sue” God for breach of contract?
Notice that no one asked for existence because they could not before they were born! No one requested to be born. This is a responsibility, a duty, a curse thrust upon us unwillingly. If we did not, could not, and probably would not ask for existence knowing what it entails, why are we the ones who are required to fit ourselves into his mold? One translation says don’t be forces into the world’s mold. Yet god’s mold is WAY more onerous for his “light” burden(s)/ yoke. Once again, no thanks forever!
It’s been a long time since I partook of the complaining at a gift/opportunity.
All life comes from God, and returns to Him. And it’s alleged that every “outpost” of His Life set forth in this world (us), is unique and was foreseen since before time. What if when we return to Him, we find out that as part of “Life” we also knew what this life would be like? What if we actually had a say in what we now live: knowing that harder paths produce a stronger organism and greater wisdom?
Having our eyes totally on the flesh, we now forget this and anguish at the path that perhaps we ourselves OK’ed. But when we return to God (the Spirit of Life) and leave this mortal coil (and toil) behind, we will once again remember that we chose this path, and that God smiled at our choice and then made available EVERYTHING we would need to not just “endure” it, but to totally triumph over it — and use the lessons/wisdom learned to help others.
And in this way, “Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on Earth (and in my heart) as it is in heaven.
Don’t gripe Jear. It’s a spirit that takes hold of a person much like depression is a spirit that takes hold of a person — even unto total imprisonment.
Yet this gift comes with a choice: worship me or face hell forever. Do things my way. Follow my rules. Be perfect. Why bother creating anything if that’s the choice you’re going to give your creation? It makes no sense!
The choice is worship Life (as a prelude to becoming one with it); or worship death (as a prelude to becoming one with it.)
Something happens in most children (dare I say, “of functional upbringing”) when they cease to see the rules as just something to rail against and skate as close to without falling into punishment) . . . to seeing the deeper purpose for them AND the love of the parents who implement them.
Once you see this and start functioning out of love for your parents, “the rules” just sort of take care of themselves. You call if you’re going to be late not because you fear punishment, but because you know they will be worried.
Is there ANY ANY ANY sense in this for you Jear?
Not really!
You say that unbelievers choose hell. Yet this is obviously not the case. Look at the parable of Lazarus and the rich man who was in hell. He asked to be released from his torment. The logical thing for god to do would be to ask “well you don’t want to be here? Don’t stay. Come to heaven” Yet things did not work out that way. If the bible teaches anything that the those in hell don’t want to be there. Even if it’s an initial choice, it should be one that is reversible at any point. Once again, the bible doesn’t teach this. Once you’re there, you’re there for the duration of eternity.
Worshiping life? Worshiping death? Where does the bible use that phrase exactly? Nowhere I know of and I am
What did the rich man worship in life . . . but all things that lead to death? There’s a lesson here about adult accountability. You cannot serve and further the processes of death all your life and then when you end up with a “retirement plan” of death say “Oh, gee! I was only kidding. I didn’t mean it. I didn’t realize.”
Step out of book worship and enter the Spirit Jear. Don’t just worship the “dead words written on paper”. Read between the lines.
Both God and Jesus are repeatedly given the appelation of “Life”. The adversary is repeatedly equated with “Death”. It’s right there. Provided agenda and silliness and not accepting what our actions are worshiping don’t get in the way.
Also from that story of Lazarus and the rich man (Jesus NEVER cites it as a parable): the rich man asked for a “grand miracle” to change his kin’s mind and path so they wouldn’t end up in a conundrum of accountability like he was in and could no longer run from.
What was the response?
First things first. I’m going to address some things out of order here, the reason why should be apparent.
The bible says Jesus ALWAYS spoke in parables. Matt 13:34-35 (amplified): All these things Jesus said to the crowds in parables, and He said nothing to them without [using] a parable. This was to fulfill what was spoken by the prophet:
“I will open My mouth in parables;
I will utter things [unknown and unattainable] that have been hidden [from mankind] since the foundation of the world.”
Also, wikipedia also defines it as a parable (which is a pretty reliable source for [almost] anything… albeit NOT for college papers ;-P)
Yet it’s CLEARLY taught biblically that if a person has a change of heart on their death bed and confesses they’ll end up in heaven. There’s REALLY ***NOT*** ###THAT### much difference between being alive and dead… especially if one looks at quantum/ string theory. Therein entropy is able to be reversed.
And if you REALLY think about it, why should it matter that the rich man was dead, in hell? In the story the rich man, he realizes his mistake, wants to correct it. Reading between the lines I view his action as Repentance. Not an “oops I’m sorry,” but a thing of “Hey, I want to right the wrongs I did by making DAMN SURE that no one else suffers the SAME fate that I am facing.” And this is seen as a BAD thing? There’s something wrong with this picture. Throughout the bible repentance is shown as a good thing. Here, it’s like god’s saying “sorry, charlie!”
This is entirely a side-point, of no consequence to what I shared:
But consider that if Jesus was somehow supernaturally “limited” to speak only in parable . . . why are so many of His stories actively identified as parable? This teaching of Lazarus and the rich ruler loses none of it’s power if it WAS pure allegory; but the possibility of it being actuality, is . . . interesting. Remember, what Jesus said to the crowds in parable, He often later expanded to the Disciples beyond parable (those who had chosen to follow him at cost of their former lives).
Word o ‘pedia or word of God. Do we even need to go there in the quest for justifying things we will do “religiously”? (Make no mistake. You are on the crux of either debunking all religion of all types and growing astronomically . . . or just running off into another one were “word-of-self” is god.)
I confess that I can only guess on the “limited time offer”, keyed to the dissolution of our flesh. I have notions, ideas and theories. But every single spiritual text I’ve read remains silent on this; at least “in so many words”. (Remember, I live in a realm where I can value words, but don’t have to worship them!).
But apparently, there IS some kind of “limited time offer”. Perhaps it’s tied to faith? As in, we have to show we can effectively handle “the currency” of faith . . . before arriving in a realm where allegedly, “faith” is the only currency. The rich man languished in the realm that his exercise of faith up to that point created for him. Physical reality is replete with examples of processes we cannot just “undo” — and of opportunities that arise just once and never again.
And growing bitter about this being the way of things . . . is really ZERO “justification” for . . . anything.
Even a spoiled rich kid who “altered reality” by stamping and shouting and pouting . . . will eventually reach a point where this doesn’t work and their entire reality based on this utterly invalidates and casts them into their own personal hell where their “valued currency” is less than worthless. How do they “return to another realm” to acquire the right currency for this realm . . . when nothing they have can affect this new realm in any way?
They cannot. Any more than you can return a fried egg to it’s former liquid state.
The most succinct thing (and damning of the almighty) this VERY notion of this limit to a being that is infinite… is a bad precedent to say the least. He wants repentance, and yet when offered it, blatantly refused. No thank you.
Do you have another way of saying this? I am finding it very hard to parse exactly what it is you are trying to say.
It almost sounds like you’re saying immaturity is somehow proof that God is cruel?
No. What I’m saying is that since god’s love, forgiveness, and mercy is infinite it makes no sense for him to limit anything, including forgiveness, redemption after death. If many of the the stories /parables are a true representation of god’s character , I want nothing to do with it, because it is far too limited for a being of such infinitude.
That is a bit like saying if someone is nice and rich they should just give me money to prove their niceness!
A wise parent places limits on their child; and on their responses to that child trying to exert control over them!! And the child not being able to, or stubbornly refusing to see the good intent behind this, does not exclude that there is good intent behind this.
Remember that a mix of bad teaching, and your realization that it was bad teaching colors your current perspectives of Scripture.
But no matter how rich a person is, there is a limit, whereas god has none, except those self imposed. Such a being should not be able to limit itself because to do so would be an attempt to contain infinity, an impossible task even FOR the infinite (wrap your brain around that will you!)
So if God were a Lesser God you would not be so judgmental?
You seem to desperately want a less powerful extremely bitter and vengeful rule-book god rather than one who is like a wise and loving parent.
Any ideas why?
“Vengeance is mine” anyone?
Why would I want to acknowledge a god who would condemn someone in hell to remain there who not only WANTS to escape the torture…. BUT also has a desire to right the wrongs AND has offered a logical solution to alieve OTHERS of the burden of having to face the SAME fate? How wise is it to leave them there? What’s shown here is the exact opposite of wisdom; it shows Foolishness!
You probably don’t care to finish that verse and establish its context in the greater whole?
The entire Spirit of that verse is that we should not seek retaliation and vengeance. It just f**** us up internally!
Take a look at the sad example of OJ Simpson. I doubt God is up in heaven repeatedly hitting the “Vengeance on OJ” button with a foam bat! “God’s Vengeance” in this case [and all cases??] is simply letting natural consequences for choices freely taken run their course. Do you really think there’s any hell more exquisite than the one OJ has crafted for himself?
And I would allege that physical death would be no respite for him. There is a way out of his torment ” before the die is cast and the eggs are boiled”. But will his flesh and his agendas let him take advantage of it?
Yet by NOT following the world’s advice, and cutting him out of my life (and by extension my parent’s lives) by telling my parents my brother was allowed to come back after what he did to me years ago, was welcome here, I opened her up to having health problems because if he wasn’t allowed here, he likely wouldn’t have met the guy who he was arguing with. But like Pandora’s box, the damage’s been done. We were in a good place before he met this guy with mental health problems. This guy likes opening old wounds and pouring salt into them, but he doesn’t know what he’s doing.
There comes a time when we have to forgive the past and let It past from baggage to history.
Otherwise it will haunt us psychologically and spiritually.
I had forgiven my brother completely. But new issues arose, reopening old wounds, the least of which recently is theft. I know it was only $5. but still, if i have it and you need it, ask. If I can’t afford it, figure something else out… but DON’T take my money. This schizophrenic idiot living here with us complicates things needlessly, claiming that I am trying to cause problems. I may be a mess up on other things, but I KNOW 100% that I did NOT spend that $$!
After forgiveness for specific acts there is forgiveness for just being an imperfect human; forgiveness for being so stuck in prisons of mindset and agenda that “they know not what they do” – Jesus
This isn’t easy at first. Ego makes it seem damn near impossible . But it’s a hell of a lot easier than being angry and bitter and looking for the next shoe to drop all the time.
I do not agree with public shaming, but you do have to realize we are in different times with Social Media. What you say will be out there, and you will have to deal with any backlash.
Fragility comes from the participation trophies that these millennials received when they were playing U6 soccer.
I come from a time when there was a gentler more instructional shaming. If you did something shameful and did not register shame, it was said “you ought to be ashamed”. And in this was the drive to self-examine and the motivation to change.
It was more of discipleship and discipline for the sake of the other and the greater whole, than of devastation for the sake of empowering the shamer.
All cultures that have endured have had some form of this.
But when I think of all of the other good concepts of society relationship and spirituality that have been redefined into something false and brutal, I am not surprised to see public shaming becoming the blight that it is
Unfortunately in today’s world, public shaming is not “the drive to self-examine and the motivation to change” (it used to be, I agree), but it’s “see how much better I am than you, because of what you did?” The whole “it’s all about me, look at ME!!” attitude of today’s society.
A good question then, would be if we’re going to let a few people (or even a lot) misusing something good, have us “banning” it as a society?
I look at the example of banning spanking your child. A few misused it — and the “lemmings” went off on it as if every sharp and effective discipline by a parent was simply them venting or getting their kicks at the expense of a child.
But now we have several generations with horrendous authority issues and thinking it “cruel” and “abusive” when they receive the full adult consequence for processes that SHOULD have been quickly and effectively dealt with in them, in their childhood.
unfortunately yes.
today, one person has a much bigger voice.
think of the voice a few people (or even a lot) has.
(the times – they are a-changin’)
Mobs have always wielded power. Not a lot of intelligence wisdom or foresight though!
I counted a shame in this day and age that this is what so many want our species to be known for.